Just so you know, many people pronounce it Aug-GUS-tin (I do), but I have known many educated people who pronounce it AUG-us-teen. As far as I know, both pronunciations are considered to be acceptable.
JaneC | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 2:06 am | #

Thanks, JaneC. I feel a little better now.
Dawn Eden | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 2:22 am | #

At the Greek Orthodox shrine in St AUG-us-teen, Florida you can probably pick up a copy of "The Confessions" by St Aug-GUS-tin.

Dawn, if you haven't already, read "Life of Christ" by Fulton Sheen. I'm too young

Wait. Let me repeat. I'm too young (not often I get to say that) to remember his TV shows when they were current. But, a few years back, I used to watch them daily on Cable.

Bishop Sheen is wonderful.
Fr Joseph Huneycutt | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 6:54 am | #

Ah, the wonderful Sheen...

Never had an original theological idea in his life, but he remains one of the best evangelists of our time. His simple presentation brought and still brings many to a deeper understanding of our faith.
Andy | 02.28.07 - 8:07 am | #

I really liked America's Bishop: The Life and Times of Fulton J. Sheen which came out a few years ago. A recurring theme is Sheen's struggle with his own ambition.
Anne Crockett | 02.28.07 - 8:38 am | #

Dawn, why is any obsession long and overdue? Why embarrassment? Are you obsessed already? All these questions!!
Theofile | 02.28.07 - 8:57 am | #

Dawn, I'm a convert too. We named our first child Augustin. We left the "e" off the end to help the family (not catholic) pronounce it correctly. It didn't help, I have to say . . . people will still get steen out of stin, and they probably think we just can't spell. Well, that's okay, because we think they can't pronounce. ;-)

It is my shame to admit that I've never really been able to "connect" with Fulton J Sheen . . . I do feel badly about it, because he's obviously beloved by many . . . I guess you just can't force this kind of thing.
Monica | 02.28.07 - 9:00 am | #

Dawn, as for the Act of Contrition, don't sweat it, most Catholics couldn't recite it if their lives depended on it, and priests should know that!
It's not PC to teach it in CCD classes anymore. Except mine, where we learn it in English AND Spanish.
leticia velasquez | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 9:22 am | #

The whole Augustine pronunciation is annoying. I live in the Diocese of St. Augustine which is pronounced different from the saint's name. So on our feast day we always have a lecture and of course we get a talk on St. Aug-GUS-tin in the diocese of St. AUG-us-teen.

As for Archbishop Sheen he is awesome. Highly recommended is his life of Christ called simply "Life of Christ" and his book on Mary, "The World's First Love."

One amazing fact about him is that his TV series "Life is worth living" was at one time the #1 show surpassing Milton Berle's show. The Archbishop once quipped about this "I had better writers - Matthew, Mark, Luke and John."
Jeff Miller | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 9:36 am | #

I date myself in the confessional with my version of the Act of Contrition (mid-1960's) which had just been "modernized" with "because of Thy just punishments" instead of "because I dread the loss of Heaven and the pains of Hell." It's also chock-full of Thee's and Thy's.

I see no reason to brush up on a new one, but I have to be careful not to rattle it off (I've known it for nearly 45 years!), but to speak it as truth.
Therese Z | 02.28.07 - 9:38 am | #

Therese Z, I learned the Act of Contrition in the post-Vatican II, happy-clappy early '70s and the nuns taught me about the "loss of heaven and the pains of hell." I'm glad they did. I still say it that way.
Niall Mor | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 10:28 am | #

Delighted that you've discovered FJS--definitely work your way to "Life of Christ," and if you can find it, "These are the Sacraments."
I had the prodigious blessing of hearing Sheen preach during a brief period of renewed activity here in NYC before his death. In college, in the depths of depression, I heard him preach his famous Good Friday homily, and the experience literally reshaped my soul. I also had a chance to meet him briefly several times.
And here's what you won't learn from Wikipedia, or even the unconscionably bad video record of his preaching: He was--is--one of the great saints of the 20th Century. Perfect, no, but that is the point of sainthood, the surmounting of deep flaws. He radiated a quality--one that I call, after Chesterton, "cosmic mirth"--that I have encountered in only one other adult, the Dalai Lama. Tragically, he may yet go down in newsclip amber as a Cold Warrior/TV novelty act, an artifact of Fifties American Catholicism rampant who was "kicked upstairs" in a late-life in-house ecclessial power struggle. Or worse yet, be remembered merely as the glib and charismatic guy who drew angels on a blackboard and beat Uncle Miltie in the ratings.
In fact, he was a mystic of the truest kind (no mere "theologian," "original" or otherwise), and his famously hypnotic eyes burned with some interior suffering that only he knew. To touch his hand was to be in the presence of electrifying grace, not mere charisma. His "dated" topical commentaries on the evils of Communism and the pitfalls of modernity have stood the test of time to become astonishingly prophetic. And his gifts as a communicator--which he could dial up or down in sophistication with no loss of mastery depending on his audience--have brought countless souls into the Body of Christ, including my own father,who was introduced to the young Rev.Sheen in the 1930s through the "Catholic Radio Hour." I grew up in a house with many of Sheen's autographed books (each autograph preceded by "God Love You"), and pray daily for his canonization. The bio that does him justice has yet to be written. But he's waiting to hear from you as a powerful intercessor, and given his gifts as a media master, I nominate him for Patron Saint of the Internet.
St. Fulton Sheen, pray for us!
Brenda from Flatbush | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 10:56 am | #

Hi Dawn:

Bishop Sheen is one of my all-time faves. I'm rereading "The Divine Romance" for Lent. It's beautiful.

And I don't know how high on your forehead you're beginning the Sign of the Cross, but as a mutual priest friend of ours once said, "If I could start at the top of my head and reach my toes when I make the Sign of the Cross, I would. I need all the help I can get!"

Enjoy your new-found obsession.
June A. | 02.28.07 - 11:02 am | #

Bishop Sheen isn't canonized yet, but there is a cause going for him. I think he interceded for my brother and his then-girlfriend, who is now is wife! Yay! I love Bishop Sheen. He just. . . made SENSE. . . when he wrote and spoke.
Kate P | 02.28.07 - 11:52 am | #

I think Aurelius Augustinus would think both pronunciations in English sounded funny due to impure vowels.

In French, the accent for Augustin is on the last syllable, which rhymes with English "man."

In Spanish, the vowels are pure, but the accent is on the last syllable.

"High forehead touch"!? Who would notice that and comment on it?

You should see what little kids do as you are teaching them. Our second child, at age 2, would mimic the vertical parts of the sign very well, but then because of the mirror image shoulder issue, would go back and forth a couple of times quickly....adding emphasis on the Holy Spirit, we think. :-)

Byzantine Catholics do the shoulder touches in opposite order, I think.

Are the order of all parts of the rite of Penance part of the form? I the order of some parts were merely customary. I would count that as a small correction to etiquette...just so that you are doing what the other person expects.

At least the priest cared enough to say something, if you know what I mean.
Forrest Cavalier | 02.28.07 - 11:52 am | #

I'm not even sure which pronunciation of Augustine would come out of my mouth if I said it without thinking about it at all. Don't sweat it.

Anyway, it was AUG-us-teen that Dylan saw.
Maclin Horton | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 12:37 pm | #

Never had an original theological idea in his life

Isn't that the hallmark of a good theologian?
Ed Pie | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 12:51 pm | #

Another item missing in that biography is the fact that Fulton Sheen worked closely with Bill W. in the establishment of the 12 step program. (There was also a nun instrumental in the work but I cannot remember her name.) Bill W. also studied the faith with Bp. Sheen with a view to conversion but never did convert, for one reason or another. I am convinced that the success of the 12 step program is because it is founded in Ignatian principles, i.e. the Truth.
gsk | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 1:49 pm | #

Actually, there are two St. Augustines. The one from England is pronounced AUG-us-teen.

As for the good Archbishop, I saw him once on a Friars' Club Roast of Milton Berle, and of course they were all jazzing Milton about getting beat in the ratings by the bishop.

"Remember, Milton, your sponsor was the big bright Texaco star.

"Mine was Superstar."
Robert N G | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 2:16 pm | #

Sorry, but quibbles about whether or when it's "AUG-us-teen" or "Aug-GUS-tin" is what Shea would call majoring in the minors. In this case, very, very, very minor.
ELC | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 2:43 pm | #

It's not PC to teach it in CCD classes anymore.

I have to admit that, while I do teach the Act(s) of Contrition, I have not required rote memorization of it, but not because it is not PC -- I'm too busy presenting them with the teachings and writings of people like St. Augustine.

They can take their choice --
“My God, I am sorry for my sins with all my heart. In choosing to do wrong and failing to do good, I have sinned against you, whom I should love above all things. I firmly intend, with your help, to do penance, to sin no more, and to avoid whatever leads me to sin. Our Savior Jesus Christ suffered and died for us. In his name, my God, have mercy.” or
“My God, I am heartily sorry for having offended Thee, and I detest all my sins, because I dread the loss of Heaven and the pains of Hell, but most of all because they offend Thee, my God, Who art all-good and deserving of all my love. I firmly resolve, with the help of Thy grace to confess my sins, to do penance and to amend my life.”
Bender | 02.28.07 - 2:49 pm | #

That was no lady (in Cleveland), that was my sister!

But we are all learning, all the time, and there's no shame in it. And to further complicate matters, in England 'Augustine' developed into 'Austin' as in Powers or Texas.
Mike Walsh, MM | 02.28.07 - 2:53 pm | #

gsk - I believe the Sister you are thinking of was Sister Ignatia of the hospital in Akron, OH who worked with Dr. Bob Smith in helping formerly hopeless alcoholics. Apparently she was both formidable and loving.

As I recall from reading Susan Cheever's biography of Bill Wilson, Bill was indeed learning about Catholicism from Bp. Sheen, but he was concerned that a conversion to Catholicism would imply that AA was affiliated with the Church, and, as a result, could hinder his work with alcoholics.

Bill's former affiliation with the Oxford Groups also influenced him greatly, along with a correspondence with Karl Jung, and William James's The Varieties of Religious Experience. Whether the alcoholics know if or not, the Program is in many ways Christianity practiced in its most basic form: "Trust God, clean house, and help others."
Fallen Sparrow | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 3:35 pm | #

Thank you, Colin. I usually don't tell of the link for the same reason -- it might put people off unnecessarily. It's been a life-saver in our family and I cannot recommend it highly enough. I do hope that it is acknowledged in the bishop's Cause, to the degree he was of help to Bill and Sister I. Regardless, God knows his tremendous worth.
gsk | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 4:01 pm | #

I've noticed that in the Eastern Rite, they tend to go very high on the forehead when they cross. But then they also go right to left when they do "Holy...Spirit" at the end, which is the opposite of what we do. Both are traditional, depending on where and who you are.
Matthew of the Holy Whapping | 02.28.07 - 5:09 pm | #

He's on EWTN every Friday night (and also on the weekend some time). His words are just a true today as it was when the world was black and white.
John J. Simmins | 02.28.07 - 6:53 pm | #

Never had an original theological idea in his life...

Well, Jesus Christ is the same today, yesterday, and forever, so I think that Bishop Sheen is on to something with that.

Dawn, Three to Get Married is fantastic and you'll get a lot from it. I've been meaning to read Democracy, Communism, and Catholicism (I think that's the title) but I haven't found the time recently. And yes, his cause for sainthood is being pursued. When we ran Theology on Tap in our own parish in NJ, one of our guests was Father Andrew Apostoli - and he was so enthusiastic about it that half the talk devolved into Sheen anecdotes! (Not that we minded, since they were clearly heartfelt, and the other half of the talk more than sufficed.)
Nightfly | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 7:16 pm | #

Well, we could always just take the low road and refer to him as "St. Gus"...
SouthCoast | 02.28.07 - 10:21 pm | #

My mother sells Catholic books at some events, and everytime we go through the stock, we look at 'Three To Get Married' and *groan* "If only we could change the title!"

People seem to think it's about polygamy.
Eileen R | 02.28.07 - 10:29 pm | #

More Sheen and Berle zingers, courtesy of Wikipedia's article on the TV show (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ Life_is_Worth_Living):

Berle is reported to have joked, "We both work for the same boss, Sky Chief," making reference to a brand of gasoline produced by Texaco, his sponsor. Later, when Sheen won an Emmy, Berle quipped, "He's got better writers!" As a take-off on Berle's popular nickname with the public, Sheen once opened his program by saying, "Good evening, this is Uncle Fultie."
Mark E Soper | Homepage | 02.28.07 - 11:12 pm | #

I've heard Augustine pronounced both ways, so I wouldn't worry about it. Go back, and hear it pronouncd during his lifetime, and it was probably different yet.

On Sheen, I have to admit that, in spite of being a cradle Catholic, I thought him an artifact of the 50s until I happened to surf onto one of his 1950s vintage shows on EWTN. To my surprise, he was addressing the seduction of modern times and materialism. Wow. It was so topical, I couldn't surf on. His speech was brilliant, on the mark, and really hit home. It was also spiced with dry humor.

It was odd to watch because, as soon as you started watching it, the old grainy film was overcome, and it was a fully topical address. Since then, I've been very impressed with him.
Yeoman | 03.01.07 - 10:14 am | #

Yeoman, I had no idea that Sheen was from the 50s! When I was about eleven, in the early nineties, my parents used to go on half hour walks in the evening and asked me to stay up past my siblings' bedtime to make sure they were all sleeping and ok till they came home. I was an enthusiastic listener to talks and stories on cassette, and I worked my way through my parents' cassette shelf every night. They had a 41 cassette series of Sheen, and I listened to them with consuming interest. I believed that he was a current speaker, and it was so strange to find out eventually that he was from decades earlier.
Eileen R | 03.01.07 - 11:50 am | #

I know it's gauche to advertise the wares of others but www.keepthefaith.org actually sells talks by Bishop Sheen in mp3 format for $1 a talk.

It's amazing how prescient Archbishop Sheen truly was especially when you listen to and read his words in later life. He predicted in the 70's many of the problems we face in the post-Conciliar church today. It's a shame his influence isn't felt more strongly among our current crop of Bishops.
Anthony | Homepage | 03.01.07 - 6:23 pm | #

I also chuckled at the observation (above) that Sheen "never had an original theological idea in his life."

Thank God for that :-) Sheen is great precisely because he had a gift for communicating enduring (unoriginal!) truths in a compelling and entertaining way. That's the whole point!

I often catch Sheen's talks on Relevant Radio and am frequently amazed at how contempory he sounds. And I love the comment he made at the Emmy Awards...
CV | 03.03.07 - 11:05 am | #